I feel the need to spend some time updating this site. My focus has been doing the work and it’s difficult to want to tear myself away to do this sort of thing.
It’s been twelve long years since I began our family history work. I have mapped and built pedigrees for Jordans in all regions of NC. I have just over 120 DNA kits under my belt but still there are holes in my own pedigree work along the JORDAN side of my family. WHY?
Let me walk you through what I have learned and lived. My hope is all NC Family line work will be helped. Our State has suffered through two major hurricanes, three tornados and floods, and now a pandemic during the research window I have done this work. Every day I know I will only be able to accomplish what God allows. And I am grateful for the opportunity God has afforded me.
I came to this work with a background in research. And having to admit after so long there remains a problem yet to be solves is difficult for me. I also try to be positive and every day I knew the solution could come! But I see there is need to put down the particulars to help folks understand what specific steps are necessary and grasp why submitting DNA kits through Ancestry.com or 23andme.com or MyHeritage.com is not sufficient.
First and foremost – I am sure there is no argument we each have two sides of our pedigree – the PATERNAL SIDE and the MATERNAL SIDE.
WHO INHERITS what information matters!
The starting point and most fundamental piece of information you must focus, hurdle, and answer is
What genetic CLAN is each side of your family?
If you are a boy you can establish your paternal clan line. IF you are a girl, you cannot. So for me, I had to start of asking boys to help me! And I spent a great deal of time focused on JORDAN CLAN lines. Unfortunately, when it came to establishing the CLAN lines to help break through the brick wall there are still areas of opportunities and work to do!
STEP 1 is establishing the surname clans you were born into by getting a boy who DID inherit the CLAN ID on each side of your family to do a FTDNA DNA kit.
The chart below shows WHO a daughter should recognize as the best candidate to help get any CLAN line established, YOU START from the daughter in question and then reach out to a boy who carries the surname aka Clan ID. Boys inherit via their Y chromosome. Girls do not get a Y. Girls inherit two X chromosomes.
NOTE: a son from any of the blue shaded relatives may also be used if necessary. You want to use the closest to you but eldest living boy, most of the time he will be your CLAN line’s patriarch. IF you are a boy who is under 70 years of age and you have a living father or uncle you should get the elder male to establish your line. You can always do your own test to lock into and confirm your own specific line and provide additional other genetic inherited information shared.
What Tests Exist for PATERNAL Information?
The Ymarker test offered only by FamilyTreeDNA.com is THE LONE test currently available specifically which provides YOUR PATERNAL CLAN ID. You may have heard the term SURNAME used in the past. The more correct term is CLAN. WHY? Because the Ymarker test’s reach is 25-26 generations and there is yet to be found a CLAN TREE with only one surname! Reaching back to the Invasion of Ireland means you will find other surnames for a multitude of reasons in your CLAN TREEs.
There is a separate piece of information provided when one does the Ymarker 37, 67, 100 or BigY test (only 37markers are needed to learn one’s CLAN, the rest refines your your specific family line’s placement on a particular branch of your CLAN tree). The other information provided from a Ymarker test is your paternal HAPLOGROUP designation. HAPLOgroups are ANTHROPOLOGICAL NOT GENEALOGICAL. The Haplo work is an effort to use the CLAN information to track people’s migration. This work is from the opposite direction of genealogical work. Below is a snapshot of the haplogroup map. NOTE: this effort is ongoing and ripe with conflicts at the moment. A haplogroup designation IS NOT THE SAME AS A CLAN subgroup ID.
There are four major companies which sell DNA testing kits. Each claims to be genealogically focuses in their marketing. The reality is 23andme uses genealogy as a hook to get folks to submit kits and their actual focus is collecting medical marker information. Ancestry.com and MyHeritage.com are direct competitors who offer both subscription services for genealogical records gathering as well as genealogical DNA testing. A subscription is necessary to unlock site features and tools for genealogy work. All three, 23andme, Ancestry, and MyHeritage offer ONLY autosomal tests, AKA Family Finder tests. FamilyTreeDNA.com (FTDNA.com) is the lone company offering the full complement of genealogical DNA tests. I am going to break it down for you.
It is important to explain 23andme offers ONLY the HAPLOGROUP designation which differs from one’s CLAN ID. Haplogroup work is more anthropological. Ancestry and MyHeritage offer zero paternal or CLAN specific test and therefore zero specific information is available through them. And 23andme offers only anthropologic information.
THE AUTOSOMAL TEST
All of the labs offer the autosomal (FAMILY FINDER) test. Autosomal information is a cocktail. May offer the same test but each company delivers different information to the researcher who submitted the test kit! And the differences matter. ESPECIALLY for folks who come through North Carolina lines.
MyHeritage has a terrific article on their site which explains it very well. And it shows a significant difference between them and Ancestry.com. But if you are new to genetic testing or you have limited experience you may not fully understand who offers what and why it matters! My Heritage specifically explains
“The more DNA you share with an individual, the more recent your common ancestor was. You share around 50% of your DNA with your parents and children, 25% with your grandparents and grandchildren, and 12.5% with your cousins, uncles, aunts, nephews, and nieces.
A match of 3% or more can be helpful for your genealogical research — sometimes even less. ”
23andme and Ancestry.com both limit the number of matches you are allowed. In August of this year Ancestry.com decided to do just the opposite of what MyHeritage and FTDNA.com fully grasp. Matches with smaller centimorgan segments may be just what you need to help confirm your NC lines and solve a mystery. Ancestry carved away even more matches from view. They have an algorithm in place which is designed to limit not expand one’s research. This goes against basic research protocols AND the Field of Genealogy’s guidances which call for a researcher to gather as much information as possible.
Ancestry.com decided to create a feature a few years ago, available only to anyone who submits a DNA test through them called THRU LINES. I have published one of the glaring problems with that feature already but it is now several years old and specific to BRICKWALLS I wanted to show you exactly what we are still having to contend. And again, the workaround or solution is so simple – MOVE YOUR RAW DATA FROM other testing companies to FTDNA.com.
One of the major reasons I began using DNA in my family history work was to solve a mystery at a particular generation node. I submitted DNA to BOTH Ancestry.com AND FTDNA.com. The FTDNA kit was for the GRANDSON of baby girl born during the Civil War whose father is the mystery. It was a terrific sample to submit! Because autosomal cocktails dilute with each new generation having as a reference kit a GRANDSON was a true help for any and all descendants working to solve this same mystery.
Here are the particulars I found as I looked at our pedigree –
Fannie Love inherited X chromosome information from EACH of her parents. So it was very important to get DNA from each of her children’s line ESPECIALLY important were the children who carried that X information. So I began to reach out to descendants starting with the two who inherited the most. Our JORDAN line submitted the BEST CANDIDATE we had! And I also submitted four other kits for our JORDAN line – one of them via Ancestry.com.
Here is the chart for the descendants of this baby girl. What was needed was for each of Fannie Love Dupree’s children’s lines to submit Family Finder tests via FTDNA.com. WHY? Because via FTDNA.com we can see who inherited the precious X information. And we can compare other descendants to the Grandson who got the largest dose of autosomal DNA!
Unfortunately kits were not submitted over the last decade by many descendants to the same lab. Submissions to different databases meant kits not communicating with one another. Remember genetic genealogy tools are a comparative tool. We need two or more kits talking to each other. I offered to pay for kits – I offered to move raw data. I have tried as best as I can to get us all on the same page. Remember Ancestry.com and 23andme do not provide the ability to transfer raw data to their site/database. Our kit was submitted a decade ago to FTDNA because it was the best lab to use to anchor this important work. Keep in mind it was submitted to help solve the mystery of Fannie’s dad AND also establish our JORDAN CLAN line
I never dreamed it would be so hard to get folks to work together.
NOTE: there is one exception. Not all 23andme raw data can be transferred.. The cost to move raw data is only $19. IF anyone is reading this from our lines please reach out to me via email on this site or find me on Ancestry.com and I will gladly get your raw data moved and work with you or follow the directions FTDNA.com has kindly published on their website.
“The following describes how to access and download your autosomal raw data from AncestryDNA:
- Navigate to the Ancestry.com website homepage.
- In the upper-right corner, click Sign In to display the sign in window.
- In the Username or email field, enter your username or email.
- In the Password field, enter your password.
- Click Sign In. Your Ancestry home page is displayed.
- On the menu bar, click DNA > Your DNA Results Summary. The AncestryDNA home page is displayed.
- On the right side of the page, click Settings. Your Test Settings page is displayed.
- Scroll down the page.
- On the right side of the page, in the Download your raw DNA data section, click Get Started. The Download your raw DNA data window is displayed.
- Enter your password in the empty field.
- Click Confirm. A window requesting that you check your email is displayed.
- Check your email for an email from AncestryDNA with the subject line Your request to download AncestryDNA raw data.
- In the email, click Confirm Data Download. You will be redirected to the Ancestry.com website.
- Enter your username or email and password in the appropriate fields, and click Sign In. The Download DNA Raw Data page is displayed.
- Click Download DNA Raw Data to download your raw data file. Note where you save the file on your computer.”
There is a great effort by some companies to draw you to order Family Finder tests from their company so they can profit. I have wondered why some bloggers have made some of the claims professing a particular company was superior or the best when it just isn’t! It isn’t a question of personal preference. It is a question of delivering information back to the researcher for the researcher to use. I disagree with much of what has been claimed in TV ads by two of these companies and I will tell you why. After a decade of working DNA matches on Ancestry’s site AND FTDNA without any hesitation there is a HUGE deficiency with testing with Ancestry.com.
Ancestry.com has actually crippled the effort to solve the mystery I joined Ancestry and submitted a kit to solve.
WE NEED for anyone working North Carolina lines to MOVE THEIR RAW DATA TO FTDNA.com.
ENDOGAMY – Our Nemesis
Endogamy is defined in two ways: anthropologically it is defined as the custom of marrying only within the limits of a local community, clan, or tribe; biologically it is defined as the fusion of reproductive cells from related individuals; inbreeding; self-pollination.
Anyone working the family lines involving the mystery of the father of Fannie Love knows this term or at the very least its effect on interpreting autosomal matches.
Many families have lived in the same region of NC and intermarried over time. This means by default our genetic genealogy work falls on the advanced level.
Autosomal DNA is a cocktail of information derived from multiple generations. So we often find we are inter-related via CLAN lines who converge at multiple generation nodes. The term double cousin seems almost too weak to describe what DNA from current generations bring to the genetic genealogy table for us to evaluate. And consequentially we need LOTS of cooperation and participation to zero in on a particular CLAN line at a specific generation node. It can be done. I have helped to solve 13 mystery parents and the only reason there is a delay in solving any mystery is missing kits from the FTDNA database. Could be someone did a kit at a different lab. Could be someone did a kit through the right lab but did not include the proper genealogical DNA tests. Establishing takes Ymarker tests and anchoring takes autosomal tests! For our region we live in a community where our ancestors have lived for centuries. Wars and weather events have destroyed paper records, and in some cases records were never made. But there is ancestral information inherited by each of us.
IN ORDER FOR ANY NC family line to properly evaluate autosomal matches they have to FIRST KNOW THE CLAN ID each parent at each generation node belongs. In order to actually be able to work autosomal tests properly you have to know the CLAN IDs first!
SO – hopefully you can see that the different testing labs are not all the same and it is critically important to do our work via FTDNA (you can still use Ancestry.com too. It is a great addition but it just can’t get you started correctly and it can cause problems).
Let me explain one of the reasons a few years ago I amped up the effort to try and get everyone who descends from FANNIE to do FTDNA kits or move their raw data from Ancestry.com. There are many kits submitted to Ancestry by Fannie’s descendants. BUT what Ancestry has done to us is pitiful!
Here is the screenshot from the tree I built which is attached to the DNA kit I submitted to ANCESTRY.com – granted it was for a much younger descendant. The real BREAD AND BUTTER kit was submitted via FTDNA.com because there the X tract and the complete autosomal signatures could be found and worked! The kit submitted via Ancestry was unable to be phased because the father of the submitted had died LONG before this sort of work was even possible! During the early days at Ancestry’s DNA there was little to no filters. It was not until a year ago we could actually build out a match and attach to your tree. Even after this, Ancestry still limits how they define matches – only by range of relationship not actual familiar relationships. It is very possible to share an amount of DNA but be misdirected by Ancestry.com. When ThruLines first rolled out Ancestry had a habit of connecting step parents who had zero DNA or far less DNA than should be found at a particular generation node and then sending a researcher off on a primrose pedigree journey.
THE QUEST for ANSWERS
For our LOVE/DUPREE/JOHNSON mystery Ancestry.com decided to make the daughter, Sarah Love, the wife or partner of her dad John Alexander Love AND make baby Fannie the product of incest! I was horrified when I saw it. An urgency grew to put this mystery behind us! Here is the screenshot from our THRU-LINES
Here is a screenshot from the pedigree information attached to the DNA kit at Ancestry.com
I have connected to researchers who intersect at Sarah Love’s parents’ node -John and Sarah W Johnson LOVE. Here is the jumble I find when I look at matches. It is a horrible mess. Here is what I find when I open our LOVE relative’s kit (I have tried to be careful to protect the identity of the living as always)
Once again yet another example of how Ancestry.com relies WAY TOO MUCH on pedigree work and does not seem to be focused on providing researchers what is possible via autosomal testing. I am of the opinion Ancestry.com is the best place to do pedigree building. MyHeritage and Ancestry both offer this feature BUT Ancestry.com is located in the USA and MyHeritage is a Middle Eastern Company, focusing more on European records than USA records. And Ancestry’s pedigree feature is robust. But when it comes to DNA they only do one test and they don’t even provide the full gamut of information derived from that test or a complete match file. And Ancestry.com has practically zero tools to help any researcher work matches. And at every turn they limit our ability to help each other and work collectively to break through a brick wall! Ancestry.com makes reaching matches extremely difficult. There are restrictions at every turn. And their THRULINES product/feature can highlight flaws but the site provides no avenue to address or correct. So when tests are submitted via Ancestry.com instead of FTDNA it is an uphill task, ripe with the potential to find oneself doing primrose pedigree work.
Try as I might I could not get kin to reply to Ancestry message requests much less move their raw data to FTDNA so we could have the best site tools and information provided per kit.
A tiny baby girl was born to Sarah Love. The father of the baby girl was and is a mystery. The baby was born long before vital records were taken in North Carolina. So there was no reference birth certificate which provided a finite date, time, and place. There could have been a Bible entry. But none have been found by this researcher. Considering the baby was born during our Civil War, when so many records were not kept or destroyed, it makes any records held by any direct family precious. Several stories gained wings. I heard one unique story from the BYRD line, a different one was passed along our Jordan line, and the LOVE line contacted seemed to be totally in the dark. The classic genealogy work model failed.
The truth rests in the DNA of the descendants of Fannie Telfer Love Dupree, the tiny innocent baby girl who grew up and married Benjamin Franklin Dupree. When I began my family history work I felt this mystery was unique to our family. Now after twelve years I can tell you it is NOT unique at all. But what has been unique and frustrating is the lack of cooperation I have received to resolve the mystery. I have helped over 2000 NC families so far with their family history work. And most all have found it easy to find kin to submit DNA kits to resolve exactly this kind of mystery. But what I have endured has been odd and frustrating and honestly hurtful and I just can’t figure out why some are determined to be difficult and allow this hole to fester. Just like you have read in most of my nc1700sJordans work it isn’t difficult work provided there is cooperation.
The degree of success rests with the degree of cooperation one receives.
WHO WAS FANNIE TELFER “TEL” LOVE’s DAD?
I could have written about this particular struggle years ago but I earnestly had not anticipated problems! I planned to simply reach out to actual cousins and work together to quietly solve the mystery of the daddy for Fannie Telfer “Tel” Love Dupree, a wonderful lady born as our Nation was ripped apart by war. Every child is a blessing and this researcher has no idea if Great Grandma Fannie told her children about her father. As I worked I felt this was something never mentioned. Maybe it was out of respect. Whoever Dad was, his family history became ever entwined in our family history and for this researcher a brick wall.
It was easy to isolate the best candidates to solve this mystery. There were not many candidates still alive! I was convinced all I needed was a kit from the OTHER grandchild of Fannie Love! Helen’s descendant did not do a kit via FTDNA. I have heard a kit was done via 23andme. I have most recently sent a packet of information to hopefully get the raw data moved over. But so far I haven’t seen any evidence a DNA transfer has occurred. I keep hoping.
The glaring hole remains for all to see where Great Grandma Fannie Telfer Loves goes.
My hope was to quickly and quietly isolate, establish, and confirm the true surname for Great Grandma Fannie and discover who the Great Great Grandpa was. For goodness sake, babies born to a single mother was common in this region of NC. There were many Quakers in the region too so there was the possibility of a record which might have been lost for a marriage that the war prevented. The Quaker way to wed took months! The couple announced during a meeting their intentions and the elders formed two committees to vet the couple independently. Not all Quaker records have survived and Core Sound and Trent are two examples when they have not. And the baby was conceived as our Nation erupted in a civil war!
There also was mention in an index about Sarah Love submitting an application to be recognized as Native American. If you look at the children of FANNIE LOVE (and the lone portrait of Fannie) there are dark features which could speak of a Native connection. There is no Sub Saharan in any kit I have submitted… Our Fannie Love Dupree, daughter of Fannie and Benjamin Franklin Dupree had light hair and light eyes. She most resembled her sister Helen – ironically the two living grandchildren descend from these two sisters. But the DNA we need to explore comes through one of Henrietta’s girls’ line too. Ironically the granddaughter of Fannie’s who carried the name TELFER forward. It is not a common name though I have found it in a BEASLEY line and a Norris line. The Beasley line connects to a JOHNSON line. The
(see the chart above) I wish I had photos of the boys – Franklin Tel/Taylor Dupree and Claude Lawrence Dupree. As I look at the photos I see very similar noses and they seem to be same as their mom Fannie! Their coloring though is different –
Henrietta and Julia have very rich, dark hair and eyes. Helen and Fannie both have light hair with blue eyes.
Over and over I have seen evidence to confirm that babies bore to single moms had no stigma attached to them.
I have learned in some instances a naming game was used. Today DNA is helping us discover the particulars of this naming game. But the research stops cold and hard if cousins won’t work together. I wanted to document where I was and why so others could avoid this.
God has allowed us genetic genealogy tools that no prior generation had. But the window to use the tools correctly is not infinite. There is a time limit and there is a duty for us to work together to get certain DNA samples to FTDNA so the work can advance. If the DNA from these 70+ candidates elude us, the window of opportunity will close. There is no plan B waiting in the wings.
For many in NC they are wrestling with the same sort of brick wall. So I figured it was time to chronicle where I am and put the steps out there. I was raised to live by the Golden Rule and I have spent years helping others in our state (and a few whose family line pushed off from NC and settled in a different part of the USA). My hope is maybe by giving this wings, God will make a way for the solution to return to me.
God wanted Fannie here. She and Great Grandpa Benjamin Franklin Dupree were allowed to have a large family. One of their grandsons was allowed to be a respected Federal Judge.
All any researcher can do is the best God allows for each day. I fail to see the logic to allow such a mystery to remain when God has allowed the scientific toolset to solve it. If God allowed the birth, and clearly blessed the family, and provided the scientific toolset isn’t it more in line with His Word to work together to build a bridge and fix the glaring hole which broadcasts the fact Fannie was conceived out of wedlock?
I don’t begin to judge Grandma Sarah who was Grandma Fannie’s mom. There was a war and this war marched through our towns over and over again. North Carolina had men on both sides. We contributed more men to this war than any other state! So who in the world could ever think anything negative about any innocent little baby born! Interestingly as I have worked there were many other babies like Grandma Fannie and none of them boy or girl as they grew seemed to be condemned by their communities.
So why pass judgement now? Or place any sort of shame at the feet of that mother or child?
For a decade the descendants of Fannie Love Dupree, wife of Benjamin Franklin Dupree, both of Angier NC, have not cooperated with me. I have asked and asked for help. Offered to pay for kits. Actually bought a DUPREE kit after a DUPREE boy agreed to help only to have the kit never returned to the lab. For some strange reason I keep hearing “contact the LOVES”, maybe they can help” or I am promised a phone call, … I even heard from the best candidate herself during the lone brief phone call I had “to let sleeping dogs lie”. I wish someone from the SEAGROVES, DUPREE, BYRD, LOVE, JOHNSON lines would help me. I know how to do the work. But I can’t do anything without cooperation from cousins who inherited DNA that will help us solve the mysteries surrounding Sarah LOVE’s baby girl, Sarah’s mom’s – also a SARAH – who was a JOHNSON when she married John LOVE (Sarah had two children before she married John – so was she a JOHNSON by birth and her granddaughter was following the same path as her grandma or was Sarah married before she wed John? DNA holds the answers. Awkward situation, yes. TEN LONG YEARS of disappointment, absolutely.
Over the last few years I tried to track down Fannie Love Dupree’s Bible! (not our Grandma Fannie Dupree Jordan, her daughter). I kept hearing that Bible held the answer and it was last known to be in the hands of Alexander Clifton (AC) Dupree who was raised by his aunt, Julia. Julia Dupree was a daughter of Benjamin Franklin and Fannie Love Dupree. Julia never married, stayed in the family home and raised her brother Claude Lawrence Dupree’s infant son AC after AC’s mom, Eva Stancil Dupree, died during or shortly after bringing AC into this world. AC never had any children. He waited until late in life to marry and Miss Kendrick’s people were from Chatham county. The Great Aunt who supposedly all expected to do all the family history had never reached out to AC about the Bible. She was raised Mormon and bibles other than “Mrs. Jordan’s” AKA Fannie Dupree Jordan never were on her radar. I am a Baptist girl and Bibles for me are HUGE. In my lines Bibles are passed to the eldest living granddaughter. I have a collection of them. I also have learned the nephew of the Great Aunt – the very man whom she and her husband sold the Jordan home place- had done genealogy work on the family. The Jordan who handled Drexel Jordan’s estate never bothered to reach out to this Aunt to pass the information to whom the whole family considered the family historian. It could be Drexel asked AC about the bible. Most folks never took bibles but copied the information contained inside. The boxes of information may have just been destroyed when the executrix relocated two years ago. There is supposed to be a search for them as I write this.
The search for the actual Bible continues, I can’t imagine anyone destroyed a bible in our family on purpose. But in the meantime, I know DNA can solve the mysteries surrounding Fannie Telfer “Tel” Love, daughter of Sarah A Love. Tel was born in 1863. Some say she was born in Harnett not far from the city limits of Angiers. Others say she was born in Wake county somewhere in the Middle Creek township. She was given the unusual middle name of Telfer. Could that middle name lend a clue to her father’s identity? The name was passed onto to some of Tel’s children. No one seems to know where the name originated.
As I investigated that name I found two schools of thought. Telfer seemed to be a derivation of either the surname Telfair or Tolliver. There is a longstanding argument among Telfair historians regarding kinship with a particular Telifarro family of Richmond (Henrico) VA. I knew there was a local Johnston doctor who raised his family nearby with the name Telfair but there were no Tollivers in the region at the time Fannie was conceived as far as this researcher could find. Rumors I have heard include a Yankee sympathizer from around New Bern was the father. I have heard it was a boy who lived nearby and whom Sarah Love hoped to wed who was killed during the war. I even heard the name WILSON was the surname of the father! But so far none of those rumors have led to any true research track.
Fannie wed Benjamin Franklin Dupree and her mother lived with her until her death. When she died, her son-in-law Benjamin Franklin Dupree was the informant. Sarah was noted as single in all the census reports and on her death certificate. When her daughter Fannie Telfer Love Dupree died, AC was the informant. He never offered a father for Fannie. Why?
Rumors have circled the mystery’s solution was recorded in her bible. And that was supposed to have been available to AC and passed to him when his mom died. AC died in 1992, eighteen years before I began my family history work on our Jordans.
When I began my work I was told by anyone in our Jordan clan a particular Great aunt had been working on our Jordans since before I was born and she had everything I needed. Well, she didn’t. When I reached out to her she was very kind and she had Fannie Dupree Jordan’s bible but she had zero on Fannie Love. The Great Aunt’s focus, like my mother-in-law, had always been her families. In this instance, the Underwoods, Beasleys, … And the Aunt asked me for help with her families during our first phone call! She said she would share information with me IF I helped her with hers. She was stuck at Bartlett Yancey Underwood, a civil war soldier whom I truly believe lived a life worthy of a short story or screenplay. Under the DNA tab titled ” Underwoods of Caswell” you will find how I used DNA to help her. I also found his grave.
DNA is such a wonderful tool. And when cooperation is found, progress is swift.
The Jordan Cousins and their Dupree, Seagroves, Byrd, and Cates cousins seemed to never get that I’m not chasing down stories. I am actually applying science to our family history to make sure the work is right. There is a process where mtDNA tests can help families with mysteries surrounding a mother at any generation node. However when using mtDNA it is necessary to come to that test with two or more kits directly from your pedigree! Without that, there is zero reason to do that test in my opinion.
Right now we have terrific tools for the first through 5-7 generations. And we have the Ymarker and MtDNA tests to help us with the father’s father’s father’s line and the mother’s mother’s mother’s line. We needed a girl whose mother’s mother’s line mirrored our JORDAN kit’s pedigree and followed the DUPREE, LOVE, JOHNSON track.
My own continued frustration and brickwall will hopefully serve to demonstrate how important it is for cousins to work together. There are times when it is necessary while DNA mapping the paternal branch a researcher needs to reach out to a 3th, 4th, 5th, 6st,.. cousin’s line to confirm the branch back to an earlier shared great+ grandpa.
Cooperation is never more needed than when there is a mystery/brickwall!
As I have stated repeatedly on this site –
“Success will be measured by the degree of cooperation received”
Let me be clear the cooperation is 9 times out of 10 needed from actual family, cousins, who carry information from our ancestors forward. So when and if folks reach out, try to realize that even though you may not have grown up with the researcher, the work and effort is for YOUR family and being done by family.
Let’s get down to specifics. The mtDNA tests provides the mother’s mother’s mother’s line of information for an individual. Either a boy or girl in your family tree can do this test BUT remember it their mother’s mother’s mother’s branch being provided, not necessarily yours!
This test is the THIRD one to use in your family history work. The Y37 or greater marker test must be used to identify and establish the surname of the line you are working – anywhere in your pedigree. And the man who swabs his cheeks for you should be the eldest living in your direct line you can find.
The second step is the Family Finder test and that test should be included with each kit where the Ymarker test is done. This anchors a particular line of families via a surname AND puts them in specific locations. This test, if ordered through FamilyTreeDNA.com includes an X chromosome filter. Ancestry doesn’t. This is another reason to choose FTDNA.com as the lab to do ALL of your DNA family history work. The expression “You can’t get there from here” applies over and over when one chooses to use ONLY Ancestry.com’s Family Finder (autosomal test). When it comes to a mystery parent in one’s pedigree, remembering no genealogical DNA test is a paternity test!, it will take all three – Ymarker, Family Finder, and Mitochondrial tests to fully prove a relationship. It may be true Ancestry bought several paternity labs databases in the past. But the reality is they only sell Autosomal tests now. And these tests don’t include X chromosome information.
The third step is to use the mitochondrial test using two people in your family – one boy and one girl to identify and establish the mother’s mother’s mother’s line. Be sure and anchor all mtDNA kits too. You need to be able to plot each generation node.
You can’t just submit two mtDNA kits and draw a conclusion. The reason many folks are frustrated with DNA testing is because they either use Ancestry or 23andme and those labs do not have proper tests to effectively do family history work. Or they are under the impression you have to only swab your cheeks, send off a kit and you will receive a package from the lab with everything you ever wanted to know about your family history. That is unrealistic. The reality is each test brings unique information to light.
And if you submit only a Ymarker test you will never be able to put that puzzle piece of information correctly in your work UNLESS you anchor it by including the Family Finder test too for that specific kit. There are some folks who didn’t realize the importance of using their eldest male and there is already a Ymarker test and it would be best to submit a new kit for an older male relative and order only the Family Finder test! That is fine too. Some purists believe you need to include a ymarker to link the elder with the younger kit but I feel that is a waste of money! You can and should include Family Finder tests for your the eldest living females, great aunts, grandma, or great grandmas because each one brings information forward that differs from the boys/males doing most of the anchoring.
There is one instance when these female kits are critical. And that is when there is a surname switch or there is a mystery parent. For those situations it is vital to get every bit of information with the longest reach you can find! This is when cousins working together becomes so important.
The only thing any two matching kits will tell you is some relationship information between the two testers. With Ymarker tests you are isolating a branch of an unique family tree and the reach of the test is 26 generations and identifying the actual surname tree involved. The Y marker test will only give you the branch and perhaps how close you are to each of your matches along a branch. The family finder test will give you the ability to plot your branch back 1-7 generations and an X filter. The reach of the mtDNA is 52 generations. So you have the possibility of 52 possible different surnames. It will take all three tests working similarly to how a Sudoku puzzle works to have enough information to identify a mystery parent.
You must use Y-marker and family finder tests in conjunction with mtDNA tests to properly triangulate – find the proper the generation and specific side, father’s or mother’s, for the match. The way to do this is to include the brothers and sisters for the generation node. The generation node is the set of parents. Most of the mysteries in NC exist because of a loss of records. Families may not have spoken about a bastard child’s parentage or a nefarious ancestor but there was more than likely some sort of paper trail at one time through the courts for events involving the two. There may have been a bastardy bond at one time for our mystery great+ grandpa and our Great Grandma Fannie’s birth! BUT in the Coastal Plains of North Carolina, and specifically Harnett County where the courthouse burned not once, not twice, not three times, but FOUR TIMES, there are few records for wide swaths of time. Genealogical DNA is a blessing for any Coastal Plains Carolina family researcher! After each DNA test results populate it is vital you re-examine the paper records. The information passed down from our ancestors will help us see those paper records with clarity and a more refined focus.
Let’s go through the steps using our own family (here is the reference pedigree chart):
There are a few problems with our JORDANS. Many families submit Family Finder tests through Ancestry, FamilyTreeDNA, or 23and me. I am going to show you why using FamilyTreeDNA.com should be the first and in most cases the only lab one needs to use.
I have submitted three generations of JORDANS. Each one brings a new mtDNA line to the DNA research table. Using the above diagram, you can see starting with the home person whose entire maternal side is irrelevant and whose family finder test may shed a bit of light. His mother’s mother’s mother’s line is as follows:
FURMAN, BYRUM, DOUGHTY (sometimes spelled DOWTY or DOWDY), BELL,…
So he is on the fringe when evaluating Family Finder tests’ results. Remember too, a family finder test is like a net, they capture all of these cousins within a 5-7 generation range. * Ancestry’s reach is only 1-4 generations. I don’t understand why anyone would do a kit through Ancestry for that reason alone! But there is more. The home person is male so he inherited only one X and it tracks through his maternal side. Because this tester is so far from the mystery he is not a candidate to help solve the mysteries surrounding either Fannie Telfer “Tel” Love Dupree direct family, specifically who her dad was and if her grandma was a JOHNSON by birth. Of note, Ancestry.com does not include X chromosome filters which are vitally important to genealogical work. Yet another reason to use FTDNA.com and not Ancestry.com or 23andme.com in my opinion.
So using the pedigree chart above, the next generation JORDANs would be the father of the home person, his name was Linwood Jordan. He and his father died long before I was asked by Woody’s first wife to take a look at the Jordans. Following along the DNA kit for Woody’s brother brought a different maternal line into focus:
ADAMS, STUART, JONES, (WHITTINGTON, BARBER, SPEIGHT, …- past the diagram above)
His Y marker test will simply provide the Father’s father’s father’s information. The test has the ability to confirm the pedigree work for the home person (and if there are other Jordans who have established their branch, the Ymarker test has the ability to show if, how, and how close each Jordan branch relate). However when it comes to a mystery parent it is critical to get the exact mother’s branch isolated and confirmed by Y-marker. And anchored by including the Family Finder test. In this case it would take a direct descendant of Sarah A Love’s dad’s Loves. But this is not the First STEP.
The first step is to isolate two kits specific for descendants of the illegitimate child – one boy and one girl. The reason for the two kits is to be able to isolate information shared by the two. Boys get one X from their mother’s side. Their mother gets two, XX – one from their DAD and one from their mom. In our case our Grandma Fannie Dupree Jordan could have passed along the exact X copy BENJAMIN FRANKLIN DUPREE got from his mom. Or he could have received the X passed down from Fannie Telfer Love Dupree that she received. The reason for needing as many of the girls as possible is they carry the MOST X information forward. In our case the brothers of our Fannie Dupree Jordan were all deceased. And the X information died with them! They did not pass this information to their children.
The best candidate (not her daughter) was the daughter of Helen Dupree. She is first cousins with our Great Uncle Jordan. Helen and our Fannie were sisters and shared the same parents, Benjamin and Fannie Telfer Love Dupree. Each child received an unique cocktail of autosomal information from each parent. It is impossible to only submit our Jordan kit and expect to be able to fully read the information alone. WE NEED actual family to help us.
In this particular case we need Fannie Dupree’s sisters’ female children (our great Uncle’s Aunts lines) to help.
Each daughter receives TWO XXs. Our kit is for the last living child of our Fannie. There are no daughters to test. Eugenia Jordan Wilkerson and Fannie Jordan Brooks died long before this work began. So we need to go back to the Fannie Dupree Jordan’s sisters. There is a best candidate who would have received one X from her SEAGROVES branch and one X from her DUPREE side. It is this researchers hope that the two kits because ours is a boy where only a X is passed from the mom’s side will be enough. It would be even better to have the CATES’ girls to submit Family Finder tests through FTDNA to allow enough X chromosome information to help us isolate Fannie Telfer Love’s X information. Remember she received two X chromosomes. One from the mystery dad and one from Sarah Love, her mom. It is important to understand autosomal dna dilutes with every generation so the closer to Fannie Telfer Love we get the more clear and abundant the information we have. Another reason why the cooperation by our Seagroves cousin is so critical.
Here are graphics I found online that help to clearly explain how the X information travels. If you want to learn more I suggest you go to his site. He did a terrific job of explaining the X chromosome. All of the images explaining the X chromosomes comes from his site. I pulled out a few of his graphs to demonstrate specifically for our mystery how it works.
For our JORDAN KIT (a boy) . The first image shows his mom giving him the exact copy she received from her DAD who got it from HIS mom! The second image shows his mom giving him a mix of X received from her mom’s side where his mom got a mix from HER mom’s side! It may sound confusing (partly because for us our Jordan’s mom was named after HER mom! Both Fannie Telfers Duprees, one by birth and one by marriage)
Look at the pedigree chart again. We reached by one more generation to the home person’s grandparents generation. Cornelius Cleveland and Fannie Dupree Jordan had a large family. But only child lives. This brings me to our third (and the first actual kit I submitted) for our eldest living male Jordan. It is always best to look at your pedigree closely and find the eldest living in each branch and get those kits submitted. They won’t be here forever and the information they received from their ancestors is so valuable. In our case priceless!
His mother’s mother’s mother’s line is PERFECT –
DUPREE, LOVE, LOVE, JOHNSON? and then it stops.
His Ymarker test will only help to confirm (or DNA map) our specific JORDAN branch. His family finder test includes terrific centimorgans of information but how to evaluate it? The reach of his kit definitely includes the mystery zone. Why can’t the Family Finder test alone allow him to solve this mystery? Two reasons –
First, his paternal branch is broken. That means he doesn’t know each node back to the 5-7th generations!
Second, he has two mystery maiden names too. His Great Great Great Grandpa Joseph A Jordan married a Rebecca. Her surname is not known. And his father, our earliest known JORDAN male, Matthew M (or W) Jordan wed an Abigail but her maiden name too is not know. * there is a marriage bond for a Matthew Jordan and an Abigail Medlin but the dates do not seem to work AND if he did wed this lady it opens the door for a first wife and some of the children considering the second wife as their mother because she raised them. She may not have given birth to our Joseph, if this is even the same Abigail.
Add those mysteries to the Fannie Love, child of Sarah A Love and there is more DNA required. It is even more important to gather DNA in such a way to illuminate that particular line.
The logical next step was and is to get a DNA kit from someone in the family whose pedigree would mirror our eldest living Jordan. There was ONLY one living female and she has so far refused to help as far as this research is aware. Out of desperation I tried to locate and contact her daughter. Her daughter refused to even call. Ironically this first cousin to our Jordans wed a man with our same surname. Her husband though is from outside of NC, so he and his daughter would be irrelevant to the nc1700sJordans work. Great Uncle Jordan’s first cousin could help tremendously resolve the hole in our shared pedigree. Her kit would help ALL the descendants of Fannie Telfer Love Dupree.
I tried for seven years to reach family members who could help me quietly just submit the kits and work the matches and solve this mystery and allow the family history work to continue. The glaring hole in the pedigree work would disappear. FTDNA.com is designed to be a researcher’s friend. There are layers of privacy protection. The information belongs to the owners of the kits. At Ancestry and 23andme and Gedmatch the information becomes theirs! FTDNA’s lab can do any of the genealogical DNA tests necessary to help researchers with their work.
I found one person who had submitted DNA through Ancestry who comes through Henrietta Byrd’s line after the Seagroves kit failed. The kit appears to be for a boy however.
Adding layers of difficulties, whoever the kit owner is has chosen to keep her tree private crippling the ability to even properly work a match via Ancestry’s system and paralyzing my ability to learn of descendants who may be able to help. I am a stranger to many. But if I could get help from folks whom the best candidate knew … or gain help along a different Dupree/Byrd track… In my opinion, it isn’t helping anyone on Ancestry to submit the Byrd kit and it should be moved to FTDNA.com. It would only cost $19. So far that hasn’t happened. You will note I sent a message to the owner and so far have not received any reply.
But keep in mind this Byrd Kit may help us but it is outside the best candidate range. For some of the same reasons our Uncle Jordan kit was not the best choice and only provided some information.
Here is how the X chromosome option for the Seagroves cousin (or any of Henrietta’s daughters), both our Great Uncle Jordan FIRST COUSINs. The first image shows the daughter getting a mix of X passed from her paternal grandma to her son, the daughter’s dad AND a mix of X passed from her maternal side including both grandparents lines. It is not always this percentage passed to each child. So it is always best to get DNA from all available who follow this relationship range.
The second image shows what is called a nonrecombined X meaning the daughter received an exact copy of passed from the maternal grandfather’s line!
This is critical information for our family and these charts demonstrate the BEST candidates.
S0 the best candidate and line won’t help! What to do? Look at the daughters of the child. And find another second best candidate. We will lose possible terrific X chromosome information but it would help. Sadly for our Jordans, there were no living
granddaughters of Fannie Telfer “Tel” Dupree! And one granddaughter had only sons and the other granddaughter had a daughter but she also died and had no daughters. So we need help from family. The best our branch could bring to the research table was the single kit done by our eldest living Boy Jordan, a great uncle.
Fannie Love Dupree had several daughters! All are deceased.
One daughter, Julia Dupree, never wed. She raised one of her brother Claude Lawrence Dupree’s sons as her own. Claude’s first wife died during or shortly after delivering Alexander Clifton “AC” Dupree.
The eldest daughter was Henrietta Dupree. She wed Richard Alexander Byrd. Henrietta has passed on to glory. She had four daughters!
One daughter Clara Retta (possibly Henrietta) died before she reached her second birthday.
Hettie Ann Byrd wed Reece Seagroves and had only sons.
Rosa Tyler Byrd wed Robert Taylor Wells and had only one child, a son.
That leaves Nila Telfair Byrd. Nila wed Frank Fuller Cates and she had a large family including many daughters. And interestingly Nila’s line even carries that odd middle name which she spells Telfair, not Telfer.
If you look at the Mother’s mother’s mother’s line the pedigree is the same as our Jordan kit. So if you are reading this and you recognize your family, we are kin. Please contact me via the CONTACT tab on this site. It is private and it will allow us to work together to finally put this mystery to bed.
If you are a LOVE or a JOHNSON and you can help with the tangle surrounding Fannie Telfer Love and her grandma Sarah Sallie W or M Johnson? Let’s talk. There may be a different bible somewhere or some line of Johnsons or Loves or Duprees who has a paper record I can use. You also may be able to help by establishing your branch by submitting a kit via FTDNA.com
It is possible to solve a mystery parent. It is simply a question how much a family wants to work together to solve it. Gone are the days when this has to remain indefinitely for any family! Our Jordans have done all we can. I know God is in control and hold fast knowing HE will make a way…